Paul talks to Ran Prieur of ranprieur.com. They discuss Ran buying a house, specifically a HUD (Housing Urban Development) house, which is cheaper. Ran says that permaculture is a brand, like Nike, with the common thread of ecological and systems thinking. He would like to see permaculture keep its integrity rather than be dumbed down and taken advantage of. Ran talks about external and internal motivation, and having a community of individuals that have gotten to internal motivation and see others through their time being externally motivated and making the transition. He shares about the continuum concept, and a tribe that had zero coercion. One member of the tribe went to the city for a fews years and didn't do much of anything for a while when he came back. The rest of the tribe was patient with him, and let him do his thing. Eventually, he found his internal motivation again. Ran comments on how most of our society these days is externally motivated. He and Paul then talk about "organic." Ran grows biodynamically/permaculturally, but still buys some conventional food if the organic alternative is too expensive for him. Paul talks about Hawaiian pineapple, and Debra Berman pitches in. She says you can't judge the toxicity of a crop on just its acute toxicity--there are lots of variables. Paul says the pesticide discussion is at Wheaton Eco Level 2, and as a permaculturalist, he would like to discuss things where pesticides are irrelevant. Lastly, Ran comments on "end of the world" solutions. He used to be a doomer, but now talks about an "ongoing collapse." We are in it now and its pace may not speed up. He finds land,
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